'Staccato dots'

Messages in this thread

Staccato dots - Adrian Drover, 16 Apr 06:36AM
     Re: Staccato dots - Jody Hughes, 16 Apr 09:30AM
         Re: Staccato dots - Adrian Drover, 16 Apr 01:40PM
             Re: Staccato dots - Jody Hughes, 16 Apr 02:15PM
                 Re: Staccato dots - Adrian Drover, 16 Apr 02:32PM
                     Re: Staccato dots - Rob Tuley, 16 Apr 04:59PM
                         Re: Staccato dots - Adrian Drover, 16 Apr 10:09PM
                             Re: Staccato dots - Mike Lyons, 17 Apr 07:24AM
                                 Re: Staccato dots - Adrian Drover, 17 Apr 11:02PM
                                     Re: Staccato dots - Mike Lyons, 18 Apr 12:16PM

Staccato dots
Posted by Adrian Drover - 16 Apr 06:36AM
Group of four 16ths with staccato marks followed by quarter notes with 2 stripes (see picture). I wanted to put quadruple dots above each quarter note but the keypad has max of three and there is no zymbol. Is it OK to use single dots (as in picture)? Plays back fine, but is it fit for human consumption?
Attachment quad dots.PNG.png (11K)
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Re: Staccato dots
Posted by Jody Hughes - 16 Apr 09:30AM
Hi Adrian

As an editor I wouldn't allow this. It gives a conflict between two competing instructions (a single staccato and the four notes marked on the stem) which needs to be resolved one way or the other, and that needlessly distracts the player.

Instead, I'd use text above the first crotchet: three options come to mind: sim., (stacc.) or (stacc. sim.).

You could make a four-dot symbol and use it but it would be rather wide and cumbersome, and text will probably be better.

Hope that helps
Jeremy
--
music editor/engraver
Sibelius Ultimate on a Mac running OS 10.13.6
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Re: Staccato dots
Posted by Adrian Drover - 16 Apr 01:40PM
Thanx, Jeremy. I guess this (attached) is the best alternative then, or (considering no horizontal space has been saved) would you just write the first bar out in full in voice 1?
Attachment quad dots 2.PNG.png (23K)
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Re: Staccato dots
Posted by Jody Hughes - 16 Apr 02:15PM
Writing it out does avoid any ambiguity. I do tend to write out in the score. The short form would be more likely to save space in the part and is slightly ‘cleaner’ and easier to parse for the player (fewer noteheads to read).

I never use hidden notation for playback purposes, but I guess you could hide the crotchet with a single staccato dot and two trem slashes to get the right playback.

J
--
music editor/engraver
Sibelius Ultimate on a Mac running OS 10.13.6
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Re: Staccato dots
Posted by Adrian Drover - 16 Apr 02:32PM
Would you believe, NP plays the quarters with trem slashes practically the same as the written out staccato 16ths. So no need for voice 2. I've left the "Sim" text in, tho' I would assume that the average player would assume simile w'out being told. Thanx a lot, Jeremy, for your excellent advice.
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Re: Staccato dots
Posted by Rob Tuley - 16 Apr 04:59PM
> Would you believe, NP plays the quarters with trem slashes practically the same as the written out staccato 16ths. …
I would assume that the average player would assume simile w'out being told.

It obviously depends on the tempo, but unless it is glacially slow, how else would you play the notes on low brass? They need to be long enough to speak at all, but they are not going to be joined legato.

Of course computers are sometimes stupid enough to try to play all the notes with 100% of their written length, but NP is usually a bit smarter than that.

--
Rob

Sib 4.1, Windows 10.
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Re: Staccato dots
Posted by Adrian Drover - 16 Apr 10:09PM
Staccato 16ths are easy at q = 60 for euph & Eb tuba, Rob (I've played both), and unless a passage is slurred, NP loves to put over-generous gaps between notes.
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Re: Staccato dots
Posted by Mike Lyons - 17 Apr 07:24AM
> Staccato 16ths are easy at q = 60 for euph & Eb tuba, Rob (I've played both), and unless a passage is slurred, NP loves to put over-generous gaps between notes.

Indeed - double tongueing is fun! :-D


--
Win 10 Pro x64, Sib Ultimate 2021.2(build 3268) 2.6GHz Intel Core i7 9750H, 32GB,10TB (SSD + 7200rpm HDD), Scarlett 2i4, Sib 6.2,7.5, NotePerformer and others.
Si me castigare vis, necesse est me intellexisse.
mike@mike-lyons.co.uk
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Re: Staccato dots
Posted by Adrian Drover - 17 Apr 11:02PM (edited 17 Apr 11:03PM)
ttk, ttk. Oops, that's triple tongueing. Have you been at the Arban cornet method again, Mike?
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Re: Staccato dots
Posted by Mike Lyons - 18 Apr 12:16PM
Committed it to memory years ago when I was on Eb Bass!

tktk tktk tktktktk

--
Win 10 Pro x64, Sib Ultimate 2021.2(build 3268) 2.6GHz Intel Core i7 9750H, 32GB,10TB (SSD + 7200rpm HDD), Scarlett 2i4, Sib 6.2,7.5, NotePerformer and others.
Si me castigare vis, necesse est me intellexisse.
mike@mike-lyons.co.uk
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Messages in this thread

Staccato dots - Adrian Drover, 16 Apr 06:36AM
     Re: Staccato dots - Jody Hughes, 16 Apr 09:30AM
         Re: Staccato dots - Adrian Drover, 16 Apr 01:40PM
             Re: Staccato dots - Jody Hughes, 16 Apr 02:15PM
                 Re: Staccato dots - Adrian Drover, 16 Apr 02:32PM
                     Re: Staccato dots - Rob Tuley, 16 Apr 04:59PM
                         Re: Staccato dots - Adrian Drover, 16 Apr 10:09PM
                             Re: Staccato dots - Mike Lyons, 17 Apr 07:24AM
                                 Re: Staccato dots - Adrian Drover, 17 Apr 11:02PM
                                     Re: Staccato dots - Mike Lyons, 18 Apr 12:16PM