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'Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hairpins?'

Messages in this thread

Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hairpins? - Elliot Wright, 29 Sep 03:35AM

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hai... - Adrian Drover, 29 Sep 05:49AM

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hai... - Elliot Wright, 29 Sep 05:58AM

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hai... - Patrick O'Keefe, 29 Sep 04:31PM

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hai... - Robin Walker, 29 Sep 07:06AM

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hai... - Adrian Drover, 29 Sep 06:49PM

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hai... - Elliot Wright, 29 Sep 07:07PM

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hai... - Robin Walker, 01 Oct 12:17PM

Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hairpins?
Posted by Elliot Wright - 29 Sep 03:35AM

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Hi all, quick question for you:

When Sibelius plays a sustained note over a hairpin, what MIDI signal gets triggered or sent out?

I've noticed that in the Playback Dictionary, it doesn't say whether it's a controller value or what - it just says "Play Crescendo/Diminuendo". Is it a change in the Velocity value? A clearly defined CC number? Does anyone know exactly what message Sibelius actually sends to the VST when it encounters a cresc/dim marking in the score?

All the best,

Elliot

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hairpins?
Posted by Adrian Drover - 29 Sep 05:49AM

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Hairpins have no effect on a sustained note in midi playback. For this you need to use the plug-in Cres./Dim. Playback.

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hairpins?
Posted by Elliot Wright - 29 Sep 05:58AM

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Ok, noted, but I just figure there *must* be some kind of signal, midi or otherwise, which gets sent to Sibelius Player or to NotePerformer, to co-ordinate how to play a hairpin.

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hairpins?
Posted by Patrick O'Keefe - 29 Sep 04:31PM

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> Hairpins have no effect on a sustained note in midi playback. For this you need to use the plug-in Cres./Dim. Playback.

I thought that restriction was eliminated way back in Sib 6 (depending on the support in the sound library).

--
Patrick O'Keefe

Sib 7.5, GPO4, NotePerformer, lots of EWQL stuff
Win10 x64 Pro Intel i7-4771, 3.50Ghz, 16GB RAM

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hairpins?
Posted by Robin Walker - 29 Sep 07:06AM

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> Does anyone know exactly what message Sibelius actually sends to the VST when it encounters a cresc/dim marking in the score?

The CC used to implement cresc/dim for VSTs is defined in the SoundSet file. It might vary from instrument to instrument.

--
Sibelius 8.4/7.5.1/7.1.3/6.2/5.2.5, PhotoScore Ult 8.0.4, Dolet 6.6 for Sibelius, Windows 10 64-bit 16GB. Desktop no-name, Microsoft Surface Book.

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hairpins?
Posted by Adrian Drover - 29 Sep 06:49PM

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Posted by Patrick O'Keefe - 29 Sep 16:31
I thought that restriction was eliminated way back in Sib 6 (depending on the support in the sound library).
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

I use Yamaha XG for playback, and hairpins have never had an effect on sustained notes for me.

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hairpins?
Posted by Elliot Wright - 29 Sep 07:07PM

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Thanks Robin, good to know. So to make sure I understand correctly, Sibelius simply sends and instruction to "play cresc/dim", and the SoundSet file takes that and determines which CC message to then pass along to the VST patch?

I hope I'm not asking too much, but would you happen to know where in a Soundset file this instruction is located?

I'm currently routing Sibelius' midi data into my DAW via virtual midi cables, and I'm trying to see if I can use a converter like MidinotestoCC et al. to pickup whatever signal is being naturally sent out with regards to cresc/dim playback, and convert that to something that my EastWest VSTs will understand, like CC7 Volume or CC11 Expression. Perhaps if I can figure out how to make a simple soundset file which interprets hairpin data as a specific CC and sends that along, I can have my solution/workaround! :)

All the best,
-Elliot

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hairpins?
Posted by Robin Walker - 01 Oct 12:17PM

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> So to make sure I understand correctly, Sibelius simply sends and instruction to "play cresc/dim",
> and the SoundSet file takes that and determines which CC message to then pass along to the VST patch?
>
> I hope I'm not asking too much, but would you happen to know where in a Soundset file this instruction is located?

If you open the SoundSet XML file in a plain-text editor, you can see that each instrument has a "VolumeType" entry.

The possibilities for VolumeType text are also defined in the SoundSet, but they boil down to one of four possibilities:

- MIDI NoteOn velocity (which cannot be cresced or dimmed);
- ModWheel CC1
- Volume CC7
- Expression CC11

So cresc/dim can use CC1, CC7, or CC11 according to the separate definitions for each instrument in the SoundSet.

--
Sibelius 8.4/7.5.1/7.1.3/6.2/5.2.5, PhotoScore Ult 8.0.4, Dolet 6.6 for Sibelius, Windows 10 64-bit 16GB. Desktop no-name, Microsoft Surface Book.

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Messages in this thread

Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hairpins? - Elliot Wright, 29 Sep 03:35AM

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hai... - Adrian Drover, 29 Sep 05:49AM

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hai... - Elliot Wright, 29 Sep 05:58AM

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hai... - Patrick O'Keefe, 29 Sep 04:31PM

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hai... - Robin Walker, 29 Sep 07:06AM

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hai... - Adrian Drover, 29 Sep 06:49PM

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hai... - Elliot Wright, 29 Sep 07:07PM

Re: Sib. 7.5: What message gets sent during hai... - Robin Walker, 01 Oct 12:17PM