'Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ??'

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Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - dom.pothier, 02 Jan 01:51AM
     Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Robin Walker, 02 Jan 08:35AM
         Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Mike Lyons, 02 Jan 05:32PM
             Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Bob Zawalich, 02 Jan 06:20PM
                 Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - dom.pothier, 02 Jan 06:30PM
                 Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Laurence Payne, 02 Jan 06:31PM
                     Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - dom.pothier, 02 Jan 07:00PM
                         Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Kai Struck, 02 Jan 07:45PM
                             Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - dom.pothier, 08 Jan 11:45PM
                                 Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Robin Walker, 09 Jan 08:19AM
                                     Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - dom.pothier, 10 Jan 02:34AM
                                         Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Robin Walker, 10 Jan 08:32AM
                                             Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - dom.pothier, 25 Jan 05:06AM
                                                 Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Robin Walker, 25 Jan 08:03AM
                                                     Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - dom.pothier, 25 Jan 07:26PM
                                                         Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Robin Walker, 25 Jan 08:51PM
                                                             Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Kai Struck, 25 Jan 11:26PM
                                                             Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - dom.pothier, 28 Jan 01:36AM

Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ??
Posted by dom.pothier - 02 Jan 01:51AM (edited 02 Jan 06:30PM)
I used Sibelius to create this PDF file: http://bit.ly/2CuyPsE

But Amazon renders it as follows: http://bit.ly/2A05nW2

(And so do several other major companies.)

When I asked why, they replied: “Our Technical Department team checked your title ID 7934337 and they were able to confirm that the visual errors the your are seeing in the print interior file are a result of unembedded fonts specifically, PlantinMTStd-Regular and PlantinMTStd-Italic.”

Question:

Does this file *really* not have fonts embedded?

--
Frankie Uno
uses Sibelius Version 8.4.2
uses OS X El Capitan
MacBookPro 2.5 GHz Intel Core i7
Memory 16GB
Attachment 90874-SIBELIUS-FILE-A.sib (34K)

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Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ??
Posted by Robin Walker - 02 Jan 08:35AM
There are zero fonts embedded in a Sibelius .sib score file.

PDFs exported by Sibelius using the built-in Export to PDF function will, however, have all necessary fonts automatically embedded, and no special action is required of the user.

The PDF that you posted above was not created by Sibelius: it was created by InDesign. The problem you have lies with InDesign, not with Sibelius.

--
Sibelius 8.7.2/7.5.1/7.1.3/6.2/5.2.5, PhotoScore Ult 8.8.2, Dolet 6.6 for Sibelius, Windows 10 64-bit 16GB. Desktop, and Microsoft Surface Book.

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Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ??
Posted by Mike Lyons - 02 Jan 05:32PM
The second link points not to a pdf, but to a png file.

--
Win 10 Pro x64, 1.6GHz Intel i7 Quad core, 8GB,7TB 7200rpm HDD, Scarlett 6i6, Sib 6.2,7.5, 8.7.0 NotePerformer, GPO4 & 5, COMB2, EWQLSO Plat, EWQLSC,
Si me castigare vis, necesse est me intellexisse.

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Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ??
Posted by Bob Zawalich - 02 Jan 06:20PM
But as Robin says, if you open the PDF and look at File Properties you see the Indesign application, whereas if you export PDF from Sibelius 7+, you will see Sibelius there.

Not sure how that happened or what it means...

--
Bob

An experienced user of Sibelius. Sib 1.2 - 8, Windows 10 Pro 64 bit, 32 G RAM. Year 2017.
For plugin lookup and categories see http://www.nycmusicservices.com/musicresources
For manual plugin installation see http://www.sibelius.com/download/plugins/index.html?help=install

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Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ??
Posted by dom.pothier - 02 Jan 06:30PM
Friends,

I had my friend post on the Adobe forum, and here's what they say:

https://forums.adobe.com/message/10073825

Q1.

ANYONE ELSE ever converted .Sib files to curves?

Q2.

Is it possible I can fix this error by changing the «MAIN TEXT FONT» to Times New Roman?


The “Main Text Font” has been misconfigured to be “Opus PlainChords”. This is wrong on three counts: 1. “Opus PlainChords” is a special-purpose music font, and is not capable of being a general-purpose plain text font; 2. “Opus PlainChords” was a TrueType font intended for use with Sibelius 6 and earlier, not with Sibelius 7. Sibelius 7 has OpenType fonts, with names ending in “ Std”; 3. The “Main Text Font” misconfiguration will affect all text styles derived from plain text, such as Expression, Technique, Lyrics, and so on. It also affects the display of galleries, since this font is used for that, in all the dependent text styles. The “Main Text Font” should be configured to a true general-purpose text font, such as “Plantin MT Std” or “Times New Roman”, and not any special-purpose music font.



--
Frankie Uno
uses Sibelius Version 8.4.2
uses OS X El Capitan
MacBookPro 2.5 GHz Intel Core i7
Memory 16GB

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Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ??
Posted by Laurence Payne - 02 Jan 06:31PM
Pages exported from Sibelius then assembled into an eBook in InDesign?

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Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ??
Posted by dom.pothier - 02 Jan 07:00PM
I used Sibelius 8.4.2 to create the music, then "placed" it inside Indesign.

--
Frankie Uno
uses Sibelius Version 8.4.2
uses OS X El Capitan
MacBookPro 2.5 GHz Intel Core i7
Memory 16GB

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Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ??
Posted by Kai Struck - 02 Jan 07:45PM (edited 04 Jan 12:52PM)
The PDF looks good here (PDFXchange Editor, Sumatra) and says that all fonts are embedded.
Also conversion of Fonts to curves with Ghostscript works and looks correct.

I would blame amazon :-)
--

Windows7 Pro, Lubuntu 15.10, Sibelius 7.1.3
Free Project: LibreOffice Songbook Architect (LOSA)
http://struckkai.blogspot.de/2015/04/libreofficesongbookarchitect.html

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Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ??
Posted by dom.pothier - 08 Jan 11:45PM
HERE IS WHAT THEY SAID:

This is, indeed, a font related issue. The fonts PlantinMTStd-Regular & PlantinMTStd-Italic cannot be used commercially due to font permission restrictions. Some restrictions prevent us from successfully producing a print file, some restrictions prevent the file from printing and some do what happened in this file. In this instance, the restrictions do not prevent file processing or printing but allows the system to re-map, or replace, with an available font. With remapping, the characters may not map, or match, exactly. This can only be corrected in the submitted file. The fonts will need to be replaced or the publisher must acquire a commercially viable version of the fonts. We apologize for any inconvenience that this may cause and hopes this information helps in the publication process.

--
Frankie Uno
uses Sibelius Version 8.4.2
uses OS X El Capitan
MacBookPro 2.5 GHz Intel Core i7
Memory 16GB

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Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ??
Posted by Robin Walker - 09 Jan 08:19AM
> HERE IS WHAT THEY SAID:

Who are "THEY"?

It nevertheless remains the case that Sibelius embeds the Plantin font in its PDF exports (whether it is fully legally entitled to do that is another matter).

So, if something went wrong for you, it must have been with a software application which processed the PDF after the PDF left Sibelius. For example, InDesign.

Also, Sibelius offers House Styles that use text fonts other than Plantin, so the user can choose which text fonts to use, and select one with no rights encumbrances if they need to use the resulting score for commercial purposes.

--
Sibelius 8.7.2/7.5.1/7.1.3/6.2/5.2.5, PhotoScore Ult 8.8.2, Dolet 6.6 for Sibelius, Windows 10 64-bit 16GB. Desktop, and Microsoft Surface Book.

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Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ??
Posted by dom.pothier - 10 Jan 02:34AM
“It nevertheless remains the case that Sibelius embeds the Plantin font in its PDF exports”

Can this be eliminated?

“Also, Sibelius offers House Styles that use text fonts other than Plantin”

Should I change the «MAIN TEXT FONT» to Times New Roman?


--
Frankie Uno
uses Sibelius Version 8.4.2
uses OS X El Capitan
MacBookPro 2.5 GHz Intel Core i7
Memory 16GB

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Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ??
Posted by Robin Walker - 10 Jan 08:32AM
> Can this be eliminated?

What do you mean, exactly?

> Should I change the «MAIN TEXT FONT» to Times New Roman?

If starting a new score, you should select the "Standard Opus (Times)" House Style from the beginning.

To convert a score in mid-development, import the "Standard Opus (Times)" House Style.

To change most of the text fonts to Times without affecting other things, you can, as you suggest, just change the "Main Text Font" to "Times New Roman".

--
Sibelius 8.7.2/7.5.1/7.1.3/6.2/5.2.5, PhotoScore Ult 8.8.2, Dolet 6.6 for Sibelius, Windows 10 64-bit 16GB. Desktop, and Microsoft Surface Book.

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Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ??
Posted by dom.pothier - 25 Jan 05:06AM
I went through and took out ALL the Plantin file.

Re-submitted to Amazon — same exact errors happened.

So annoying this is!

--
Frankie Uno
uses Sibelius Version 8.4.2
uses OS X El Capitan
MacBookPro 2.5 GHz Intel Core i7
Memory 16GB

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Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ??
Posted by Robin Walker - 25 Jan 08:03AM
> I went through and took out ALL the Plantin file.
> Re-submitted to Amazon — same exact errors happened.

For a new situation, we need to see the evidence afresh all over again. Please attach:

1. The original Sibelius .sib score file;
2. The PDF resulting from export from Sibelius, before being processed by any other application;
3. The PDF after being processed by other applications (such as InDesign);
4. A screen-shot of what the problems are with Amazon.

I strongly suspect that your issue originates with InDesign, and has nothing to do with Sibelius.

--
Sibelius 8.7.2/7.5.1/7.1.3/6.2/5.2.5, PhotoScore Ult 8.8.2, Dolet 6.6 for Sibelius, Windows 10 64-bit 16GB. Desktop, and Microsoft Surface Book.

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Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ??
Posted by dom.pothier - 25 Jan 07:26PM
Here is what they say now (sounds like garbage to me):

“After reviewing your files, our Technical Services team has indicated that the issue still lies with the fonts. Please open the PDF file and go to File > Properties. On the Font tab, there will be a list of all the fonts in the file. The fonts are embedded as a subset, this means only the characters used in the document are embedded. This is causing the font problems because the full character map is not available when printed. The best solution to this is to outline the fonts. The Create Outlines command gets the font outline information from the font type, the characters are converted into outlines retaining all graphics formatting. This action will need to be taken in the parent InDesign file and outline the fonts in the file. The outline option can be found in the "Type" tab in the tool bar. Once the fonts have been outlined you can export or print as a New PDF (different name) and upload this file to your account.”

I am … not able to upload the full content to the internet, because much is under our copyright—does that make sense?

--
Frankie Uno
uses Sibelius Version 8.4.2
uses OS X El Capitan
MacBookPro 2.5 GHz Intel Core i7
Memory 16GB

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Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ??
Posted by Robin Walker - 25 Jan 08:51PM
> The fonts are embedded as a subset, this means only the characters used in the document are embedded.
> This is causing the font problems because the full character map is not available when printed.

I understand what they have said, but I am left with a question: why do they need the "full character map" for printing, when InDesign has embedded all the font characters that are actually needed by the document? Why do they need more? Can you ask them that?

And a question for you:
Are you doing the InDesign work on the same computer as Sibelius, so that all the fonts used by Sibelius are available to InDesign?

--
Sibelius 8.7.2/7.5.1/7.1.3/6.2/5.2.5, PhotoScore Ult 8.8.2, Dolet 6.6 for Sibelius, Windows 10 64-bit 16GB. Desktop, and Microsoft Surface Book.

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Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ??
Posted by Kai Struck - 25 Jan 11:26PM
If the fonts make so much trouble (and Sibelius always only embeds a subset AFAIK) I would just follow their suggestion and convert the fonts to outlines. The file size will be bigger but the blood pressure lower :-)

--

Windows7 Pro, Lubuntu 15.10, Sibelius 7.1.3
Free Project: LibreOffice Songbook Architect (LOSA)
http://struckkai.blogspot.de/2015/04/libreofficesongbookarchitect.html

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Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ??
Posted by dom.pothier - 28 Jan 01:36AM
I am not sure why they have said what they have said—when everything has worked perfectly this way for a decade.

Re: 2nd question: Yes, I am doing everything on the same computer.

--
Frankie Uno
uses Sibelius Version 8.4.2
uses OS X El Capitan
MacBookPro 2.5 GHz Intel Core i7
Memory 16GB

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Messages in this thread

Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - dom.pothier, 02 Jan 01:51AM
     Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Robin Walker, 02 Jan 08:35AM
         Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Mike Lyons, 02 Jan 05:32PM
             Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Bob Zawalich, 02 Jan 06:20PM
                 Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - dom.pothier, 02 Jan 06:30PM
                 Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Laurence Payne, 02 Jan 06:31PM
                     Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - dom.pothier, 02 Jan 07:00PM
                         Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Kai Struck, 02 Jan 07:45PM
                             Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - dom.pothier, 08 Jan 11:45PM
                                 Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Robin Walker, 09 Jan 08:19AM
                                     Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - dom.pothier, 10 Jan 02:34AM
                                         Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Robin Walker, 10 Jan 08:32AM
                                             Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - dom.pothier, 25 Jan 05:06AM
                                                 Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Robin Walker, 25 Jan 08:03AM
                                                     Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - dom.pothier, 25 Jan 07:26PM
                                                         Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Robin Walker, 25 Jan 08:51PM
                                                             Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - Kai Struck, 25 Jan 11:26PM
                                                             Re: Can Sibelius 8.4.2 embed “Plantin” Font ?? - dom.pothier, 28 Jan 01:36AM