'Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff'

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Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff - UliUli, 01 Dec 10:56PM
     Re: Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff - Adrian Drover, 01 Dec 11:55PM
         Re: Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff - Laurence Payne, 02 Dec 12:22AM
             Re: Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff - Adrian Drover, 02 Dec 08:25AM
                 Re: Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff - Laurence Payne, 02 Dec 11:08AM
     Re: Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff - Robin Walker, 02 Dec 11:52AM
         Re: Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff - UliUli, 02 Dec 08:31PM

Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff
Posted by UliUli - 01 Dec 10:56PM (edited 01 Dec 10:58PM)
In a larger orchestral piece, I'm trying to combine two flutes, two clarinets, etc. on one staff each. Is this possible? I find that I cannot enter two independent lines. If one flute has a staccato, so does the other. If one flute has a trill, so does the other. How do I make the two lines independent?
Thanks for your help,
Uli

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Re: Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff
Posted by Adrian Drover - 01 Dec 11:55PM
Top flute in voice 1.
Bottom flute in voice 2.

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Re: Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff
Posted by Laurence Payne - 02 Dec 12:22AM
But, if you're using Sibelius Sounds or similar, the sort of articulation that switches in a different sample will apply to all voices on a stave. The basic architecture of Sibelius is one stave - one sound. Paradoxically, a solution can be to use a less realistic sound set.

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Re: Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff
Posted by Adrian Drover - 02 Dec 08:25AM
So the answer is one score for playback, another for printing. NP does some strange things with articulation and legato phrasing too.

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Re: Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff
Posted by Laurence Payne - 02 Dec 11:08AM
You'll need separate staves as well as the combined one anyway, as part of the process of preparing individual Parts. The conductor will appreciate a combined stave, the players won't.

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Re: Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff
Posted by Robin Walker - 02 Dec 11:52AM
> If one flute has a staccato, so does the other. If one flute has a trill, so does the other.

The earlier responses are correct in so far as they go: in Sibelius, there is a one-to-one relationship between staves and MIDI channels. If there is more than one "voice" per staff, then those articulations which are implemented as a sample change for playback will affect all "voices" on the staff.

But, depending on the nature of the particular instrument, some effects and articulations do not involve sample changes, and yet you might still be having problems with both voices responding to written commands intended only for one voice. In this case, the cause might be an error in the way that you entered the command into the score.

Let us assume that you have correctly followed the convention for writing two voices that:
- stem up notes must be in Voice 1 (dark blue);
- stem down notes must be in Voice 2 (green).

Then,
- directions for Voice 1 only must be written in "Voice 1" (dark blue);
- directions for Voice 2 only must be written in "Voice 2" (green);
- directions for both Voices must be written in "All Voices" (pale blue).

You can set the "Voice" for text, line, or symbol, commands by selecting the text/line/symbol and then clicking on the appropriate Voice button on the keypad.

These voice rules apply also to Dynamics markings and to hairpins.

So check that your score follows the above rules first.

Next, it is possible to make multiple voices play articulations independently of each other if it is possible to reconfigure Sibelius NOT to switch samples to play the articulation, but instead to synthesize the articulation.

For instance, staccatos and trills can be played EITHER by changing sample OR by synthesizing the effect.

You can configure Sibelius NOT to change samples for staccatos or trills by editing the Playback Dictionary for the command text/line/symbol that triggers the articulation. Most articulations in the Playback Dictionary offer either a Sound ID change, or an alternative synthesized version (which is used if the sample library does not possess the necessary sample). If you de-select the Sound ID change, then Sibelius will always use the synthetic alternative. In this way, you can get two flutes on one staff playing their trills independently.

The downside of this change in the Playback Dictionary is that it affects every instrument in the whole score, not just the ones that you are trying to get to play in two voices.

A somewhat simpler way of achieving this with some instruments, without editing the Playback Dictionary, is to select Playback Configuration "Sibelius 7 Sounds (Lite)", which avoids using many of the special samples for articulations in woodwind and brass.

--
Sibelius 8.7/7.5.1/7.1.3/6.2/5.2.5, PhotoScore Ult 8.8.2, Dolet 6.6 for Sibelius, Windows 10 64-bit 16GB. Desktop, and Microsoft Surface Book.

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Re: Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff
Posted by UliUli - 02 Dec 08:31PM
Thank you very much for your prompt and useful suggestions! I now have a better idea of how to get the sound I want.
Regards,
Uli

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Messages in this thread

Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff - UliUli, 01 Dec 10:56PM
     Re: Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff - Adrian Drover, 01 Dec 11:55PM
         Re: Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff - Laurence Payne, 02 Dec 12:22AM
             Re: Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff - Adrian Drover, 02 Dec 08:25AM
                 Re: Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff - Laurence Payne, 02 Dec 11:08AM
     Re: Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff - Robin Walker, 02 Dec 11:52AM
         Re: Sib. 7.1: Two flutes on one staff - UliUli, 02 Dec 08:31PM