Sibelius - the leading music composition and notation software

Hello,
I'm not sure what is going on here. I've upgrade to 7.5 from 7.1.3 and I am still having issues with creating a title. My title default is set to 22pts in the score and 14pts in parts, but when I create the title the actual sizes are 22 in score and 44 in parts. What's happening with my title default and how can I overcome this?
Thanks

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Cobrun

Pianist, Percussionist, Piano Tuner

Re: Sib. 7.5: Title Size Issues
Posted by Roy Moore - 19 Feb 07:58AM (edited 19 Feb 11:22AM)

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You need to attach a Sib file that shows this behaviour to be certain.
Have you selected 'Keep Absolute' in parts.

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Roy Moore
London UK (2015)
Sib 7.5.1,Windows 7 SP 1 pro x64 8gb ram,2x quad core 2.5ghz , 512gb SSD Audiophile 2496
Laptop Win 8.1 - 32gb ram 512 ssd 750 hd
EW Goliath, EWQLSO platinum, Hollywood Strings Gold, QL Solo Violin, Note Performer

Re: Sib. 7.5: Title Size Issues
Posted by Bob Morabito - 19 Feb 08:54AM

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Pls see related thread by same poster:

http://www.sibelius.com/cgi-bin/helpcenter/chat/chat.pl?com=thread&start=669931&groupid=3&words=title&name=Cobrun

Thanks Bob

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Bob Morabito
Sib 5.2.5, 6.2, 7.1.3. 7.5.1
Mac OS 10.9.5 iMac 32GB RAM, 1 TB SSD

Re: Sib. 7.5: Title Size Issues
Posted by Robin Walker - 19 Feb 10:46AM

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> when I create the title the actual sizes are 22 in score and 44 in parts.

What are the staff-sizes (a) in the Full Score, and (b) in the Part?

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Sibelius 7.5.1/7.1.3/6.2/5.2.5, PhotoScore Ult 7.0.2, Dolet 6.3 for Sibelius, Windows 7 32-bit SP1 4GB, Windows 8.1 64-bit 16GB.

Re: Sib. 7.5: Title Size Issues
Posted by Cobrun - 20 Feb 02:16AM

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I'll attach a score.

--
Cobrun

Pianist, Percussionist, Piano Tuner

Attachment

Birdland.sib (88K)

Re: Sib. 7.5: Title Size Issues
Posted by Roy Moore - 20 Feb 08:49AM

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There is currently no Title showing.

After adding title or using wildcard to access score info data.

Check the settings in 'engraving rules'
You can set the font size separately for Score and Parts, if you use the right hand column and check 'keep absolute' they will not change size relative to the staff size
You can set the vertical position too.

--

Roy Moore
London UK (2015)
Sib 7.5.1,Windows 7 SP 1 pro x64 8gb ram,2x quad core 2.5ghz , 512gb SSD Audiophile 2496
Laptop Win 8.1 - 32gb ram 512 ssd 750 hd
EW Goliath, EWQLSO platinum, Hollywood Strings Gold, QL Solo Violin, Note Performer

Re: Sib. 7.5: Title Size Issues
Posted by Robin Walker - 20 Feb 09:44AM

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The attached score does not reproduce the issue described in the first post. If you want help with the issue in the first post, please attach a score which demonstrates that issue.

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Sibelius 7.5.1/7.1.3/6.2/5.2.5, PhotoScore Ult 7.0.2, Dolet 6.3 for Sibelius, Windows 7 32-bit SP1 4GB, Windows 8.1 64-bit 16GB.

Re: Sib. 7.5: Title Size Issues
Posted by Cobrun - 20 Feb 09:35PM

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Sorry I forgot the title the first time. Here is the score again with 22pt score title and 41.6pt part title. You can see in "system text style" the title in score should be 22pt and 14pt in parts, but that is not the way it is not the case here.

--
Cobrun

Pianist, Percussionist, Piano Tuner

Attachment

Birdland.sib (89K)

Re: Sib. 7.5: Title Size Issues
Posted by Robin Walker - 20 Feb 11:52PM

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After changing a Text Style, nothing happens to items of that style in the score until you select them and do "Reset Design".

When you "Reset Design" for the Titles both in the Full Score and in the Parts, then you will see the true result of the Text Style setting.

Then you need to remember that all text sizes are scaled with staff size, with the figures you gave (22pt/14pt) being appropriate only for 7mm staff sizes. Since the actual staff sizes are different from 7mm, then so the title font sizes will be different in proportion.

--
Sibelius 7.5.1/7.1.3/6.2/5.2.5, PhotoScore Ult 7.0.2, Dolet 6.3 for Sibelius, Windows 7 32-bit SP1 4GB, Windows 8.1 64-bit 16GB.

Re: Sib. 7.5: Title Size Issues
Posted by Cobrun - 24 Feb 04:05AM

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So, I am leaving my staff sizes the way they are, 8 points in score (many staves on one page, I'm not in the position to have 20 point sized staves on a Letter sized page with 20 instruments) and 15 points in parts. I think that is very reasonable. It is what I have done before (I do believe). But, after clicking "reset design" button for the 2nd or 3rd time I have no new results. When I click "reset design" the following happens, score title goes to 8.0 (not what I set in edit text styles) and part title goes to 10.5 (also not what I set in edit text styles). As you can see in this thread and the previous thread (http://www.sibelius.com/cgi-bin/helpcenter/chat/chat.pl?com=thread&start=669931&groupid=3&words=title&name=Cobrun) I have been given similar answers both times. Remember what Albert Einstein is quoted for? Insanity is doing something the same way over and over again and expecting different results...I don't want anyone else responding "use reset design". It is not working the way I use it. If I can't fix this problem I might have to create two versions of every score I make, one version where the title in the score is an appropriate size and another version where the title in the parts is an appropriate size. This shouldn't be that hard to figure out and yet we have no positive results yet. This hasn't happened to me before I upgraded to Sibelius 7.1. I used to create and arrange scores and easily Create>Title and have it automatically be the perfect size in the score and in all the parts. And now for some reason my title is big in parts and small in score. I'm still not sure what is going on. Thanks so far for the help. If anyone can figure out what the issue is please let me know. I will continue working on it myself until further notice.

--
Cobrun

Pianist, Percussionist, Piano Tuner

Re: Sib. 7.5: Title Size Issues
Posted by Robin Walker - 24 Feb 09:04AM (edited 24 Feb 09:47AM)

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"What the issue is" is that everything in a Sibelius score scales with the size of the staff. The staff size is different between the Full Score and any Parts, so the scaling is different in each. Your observations show that Sibelius is working as designed, and normally. There is nothing wrong.

If you do not want Title sizes scaling with staff sizes, then you should select "Absolute" point sizes, rather than ones that scale to 7mm staves.

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Sibelius 7.5.1/7.1.3/6.2/5.2.5, PhotoScore Ult 7.0.2, Dolet 6.3 for Sibelius, Windows 7 32-bit SP1 4GB, Windows 8.1 64-bit 16GB.

Re: Sib. 7.5: Title Size Issues
Posted by Mike Lyons - 24 Feb 09:27AM

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Have you tried importing text styles from one of the standard house styles?

--
1.6GHz Intel i7 Quad core, Win 7 Pro (x64), 8GB, 7TB HDD, Scarlett 6i6, Sib 6.2, 7.1.3, 7.5 EWQLSO Plat, Miroslav Phil, NotePerformer, Harmony Asst, EWQLSC, GPO, COMB2
Si me castigare vis, necesse est me intellexisse.

Re: Sib. 7.5: Title Size Issues
Posted by Cobrun - 27 Feb 05:17AM

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Mike, I never quite understood what importing text styles did. Where are they imported from and what is it all about? Also, Robin, thank you for helping me understand. I am just a bit confused because I thought I was easily able to make scores before without having to fiddle around with the title font sizes. I just thought it would be common sense for the Sibelius team to have had made titles in scores bigger than titles in parts regardless of staff size. Thank you folks for helping me out. I will resort to absolute staff sizes.

--
Cobrun

Pianist, Percussionist, Piano Tuner

Re: Sib. 7.5: Title Size Issues
Posted by Mike Lyons - 27 Feb 06:49AM (edited 27 Feb 07:18AM)

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Hi Cobrun, They have done this. I suggest trying to import one of the standard house styles because it might reset to that position.

A house style is just a collection of preset settings for things like note spacing, text styles, playback dictionary etc. it is fairly easy to change something in one of these areas without realising it sometimes.

Try one of the standard types at the bottom of the list first to see if this will help. Only tick the boxes for the things you want to reset - in this case text styles.

as usual, if you make a mistake or it doesn't do what you expect - [ctrl]z is your friend!

Hope you get it sorted.

Having thought about it while writing this, I disagree with you about the text size. It is more usual to have larger titles in the parts. In general, certainly with most parts I have come across, you have more space on the page than you would in a score. However, you can change this by creating your own text style after making the appropriate settings in the text styles dialog. You would have to take into account the relative sizes of the staves (All objects are scaled relative to the staff size to keep them looking in proportion.)

Once you are happy with the result, export it as a house style or export a MSS paper.

Again, hope this helps.

Hopefully the attached will help to show what should be happening.
Text sizes1 - my current settings shown at 100% zoom
Text sizes2 - the settings in the text styles dialog
Text sizes3 - The title size is changed to 48pt (again shown at 100%zoom) I would not normally do this, it is only for illustration purposes
Text sizes3 - the settings for the new size in the dialog.

The first change I made wasn't big enough to see much difference (28pt) and I had to use reset design ([ctrl][shif]d) to get it to show, but after that the change was instantly visible - even before I closed the dialog.

--
1.6GHz Intel i7 Quad core, Win 7 Pro (x64), 8GB, 7TB HDD, Scarlett 6i6, Sib 6.2, 7.1.3, 7.5 EWQLSO Plat, Miroslav Phil, NotePerformer, Harmony Asst, EWQLSC, GPO, COMB2
Si me castigare vis, necesse est me intellexisse.

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