'Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes'

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Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - dprice112, 16 Oct 07:58AM
     Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - Bob Zawalich, 16 Oct 08:38AM
         Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - dprice112, 16 Oct 09:20AM
             Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - Adrian Drover, 16 Oct 09:30AM
                 Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - Bob Zawalich, 16 Oct 04:33PM
                     Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - dprice112, 16 Oct 06:14PM
                         Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - Wim Hoogewerf, 16 Oct 07:36PM
                             Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - Bob Morabito, 16 Oct 07:40PM
                             Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - Bob Zawalich, 16 Oct 10:33PM
                                 Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - Wim Hoogewerf, 17 Oct 08:34AM

Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes
Posted by dprice112 - 16 Oct 07:58AM (edited 16 Oct 07:58AM)
Hi after running combine tied notes and rests, SIbelius left me with a lot of dotted quarter notes that start on offbeats. Is there a simple way to split these dotted quarter notes, i.e. turn screen shot 1 into 2, or do I have to individually change the rhythms by hand?

thanks,
Dylan

--
Sibelius 7.5
Mac Mini OS 10.9.4
2.6 GHz Intel Core i7
16 GB RAM

Yamaha P70 digital piano - Yamaha UX16 MIDI interface
Attachments Screen Shot 2014-10-16 at 12.51.28 AM.png (8K), Screen Shot 2014-10-16 at 12.54.37 AM.png (9K)
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Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes
Posted by Bob Zawalich - 16 Oct 08:38AM (edited 16 Oct 08:55AM)
It is curious that Combine Tied Notes does this - it is usually quite careful to show the beat, so I am not sure what rule it is using that makes the dotted quarters.

(Edit: actually, the duple beat is shown so the dotted quarter is using rules I found in the Essential Dictionary of Music Notation p 200 - Simple quadratic meter). So it is not a bug in the plugin (i.e, it is intended behavior), it's just not what you want.)

Not sure what you could use to get what you want. Divide Durations will split the dotted quarters into tied 8th notes, but you would probably have to reassemble the quarters by hand.

--
Bob

Just a user of Sibelius. Sib 1.2 - 7, Windows 7 Pro SP 1 64 bit, 4 G RAM. Year 2014.
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Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes
Posted by dprice112 - 16 Oct 09:20AM
thanks for the feedback, Bob. Yes I was thinking of using divide duration to split into eighths but reassembling the quarters will take ages (the score is roughly 2000 measures long). If there were only a way for SIbelius to divide duple time signatures further. Although perhaps screenshot 1 isn't technically wrong? it just looks alittle awkward is all

--
Sibelius 7.5
Mac Mini OS 10.9.4
2.6 GHz Intel Core i7
16 GB RAM

Yamaha P70 digital piano - Yamaha UX16 MIDI interface
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Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes
Posted by Adrian Drover - 16 Oct 09:30AM (edited 16 Oct 09:32AM)
I actually find screenshot #1 (with dotted quarter) easier to eyeball, Dylan. As long as the mid-measure division is preserved, it looks good to me, and less cluttered.
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Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes
Posted by Bob Zawalich - 16 Oct 04:33PM
I note that in Elaine Gould's "Behind Bars" in the section Meter - Cross Rhythm on page 171, she suggests writing eighth - dotted quarter, rather than 8th-8th-quarter. So she agrees with Adrian.

But if you really want to change it, and the dotted quarters you want to change are always in the same location, you might do something like:
* select all
* with advanced filter, filter for dotted quarters at the desired rhythmic location.
* run Divide Durations, unfold dotted notes, tie split notes.
Now you have 3 ties 8th notes.

* With advanced filter, filter for the second of these 8th notes in the desired rhythmic position.
* On the keypad, use 4 to turn that note and its following note to a quarter note.


With luck that would work.

A plugin could be written to do this as well, but it would be a bit tricky to do it in general.

I note that Divide Duration can split a dotted quarter by using the "multiples of quarter note " option but that will always produce quarter tied to 8th, which is not what you want. Divide Durations does not consider its rhythmic context when doing its splitting. It has enough to do you get the durations right...


Good luck with this!

--
Bob

Just a user of Sibelius. Sib 1.2 - 7, Windows 7 Pro SP 1 64 bit, 4 G RAM. Year 2014.
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Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes
Posted by dprice112 - 16 Oct 06:14PM
Thank you both for these suggestions

Bob thanks for taking me through that process, although if both of you think the eighth-quarter notation is correct, I may just stick with that. It is starting to grow on me afterall.
--
Sibelius 7.5
Mac Mini OS 10.9.4
2.6 GHz Intel Core i7
16 GB RAM

Yamaha P70 digital piano - Yamaha UX16 MIDI interface
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Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes
Posted by Wim Hoogewerf - 16 Oct 07:36PM
Don't give up!
Select as a passage all through > Filter Voice 1 and Copy
Select as a passage again and do Shift+V to Swap Voice 1 and Voice 2. Now Paste. Voice 1 will appear, modest probably the way you want. Next you can delete Voice 2 and you're done.

--
MacOS 10.9.2
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Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes
Posted by Bob Morabito - 16 Oct 07:40PM
FWIW I also think the first screen shot is ok, though Id probably prefer the second.

Thanks Bob

--
Bob Morabito
Sib 5.2.5, 6.2, 7.1.3. 7.5.1
Mac OS 10.9.5 iMac 32GB RAM, 1 TB SSD
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Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes
Posted by Bob Zawalich - 16 Oct 10:33PM
Cool idea, Wim, but I tried it and could not get it to work. I realized that filtering the voice 1 notes was key, as otherwise the past would overwrite the voice 2 notes In the screenshot, I had the music that is now green in voice 1. I filtered and copied it, and swapped voices, and the notes turned green as expected.

I then pasted and the dotted quarter still showed up in the voice 1 result.

Did you do something different?

--
Bob

Just a user of Sibelius. Sib 1.2 - 7, Windows 7 Pro SP 1 64 bit, 4 G RAM. Year 2014.
Attachment snap1.png (4K)
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Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes
Posted by Wim Hoogewerf - 17 Oct 08:34AM
Oups, I can't reproduce it, the way I described. But while searching I found what I was looking for:
Select passage all through >
Press Shift+V to Swap Voice 1 and 2 >
Filter Voice 2 and press Alt+1 to set to Voice 1.
Done.

--
MacOS 10.9.2
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Messages in this thread

Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - dprice112, 16 Oct 07:58AM
     Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - Bob Zawalich, 16 Oct 08:38AM
         Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - dprice112, 16 Oct 09:20AM
             Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - Adrian Drover, 16 Oct 09:30AM
                 Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - Bob Zawalich, 16 Oct 04:33PM
                     Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - dprice112, 16 Oct 06:14PM
                         Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - Wim Hoogewerf, 16 Oct 07:36PM
                             Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - Bob Morabito, 16 Oct 07:40PM
                             Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - Bob Zawalich, 16 Oct 10:33PM
                                 Re: Sib. 7.5: splitting dotted quarter notes - Wim Hoogewerf, 17 Oct 08:34AM