'Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff Spacing, and Lines'

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Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff Spaci... - Robin Walker, 24 Aug 05:49PM
     Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff S... - Richard Vitale, 24 Aug 07:52PM
         Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff S... - Jesper Elén, 25 Aug 05:25PM
             Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff S... - Robin Walker, 25 Aug 09:11PM
                 Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff S... - Richard Vitale, 25 Aug 09:29PM
                     Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff S... - Robin Walker, 25 Aug 09:38PM
                         Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff S... - Richard Vitale, 25 Aug 10:26PM
                             Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff S... - Jesper Elén, 26 Aug 05:22AM

Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff Spacing, and Lines
Posted by Robin Walker - 24 Aug 05:49PM
Certain Lines, such as Hairpins, have the property that, when they are placed between the two staves of a Grand Staff, they push the staves apart when "Optimize" is clicked, so as to avoid collisions between the Line and the music on the staves.

How can I create a new Line style that has the property of pushing apart the two staves of a Grand Staff when "Optimize" is clicked, in the same way?

For instance, I might want to use a dotted line with a "Cresc." header text, instead of a long hairpin crescendo. If I create such a Line Style by modifying the "dotted line" style, it does not have the effect of pushing staves apart, so it becomes one long collision with every projecting note on each staff.

Does anyone have a solution?

--
Sibelius 7.5.1/7.1.3/6.2/5.2.5, PhotoScore Ult 7.0.2, Dolet 6.3 for Sibelius, Windows 7 32-bit SP1, 4GB RAM
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Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff Spacing, and Lines
Posted by Richard Vitale - 24 Aug 07:52PM (edited 24 Aug 08:17PM)
An interesting problem Robin!

The "property" of the Crescendo Line is probably jut the horizontal width of the hairpin opening as a "symbol" of equal horizontal width also allows for proper optimization.

Putting a hairpin in, optimizing the Grand Staff (the hairpin has to be unhidden for this to work initially) and then hiding or removing the hairpin isn't a very elegant solution so I'm here to hear the answers posted as much as you.

Of course you can go to:
Engraving Rules>Staves
and increase the:
Optimize Staff Space Setting > Horizontally
from 1 to 20 (or anything up to "99")
but that may not be a viable solution either.

(Then if you add a hairpin AFTER optimization and optimize a 2nd time, the distance betweens staves will be increased a 2nd time, which may or may not be what you want.)

--
Richie Vitale-Sib 7.1.3 User
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http://www.richievitale.com
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Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff Spacing, and Lines
Posted by Jesper Elén - 25 Aug 05:25PM
I got ok results creating a new line from the trill line changing it to dotted line and adding crescendo text in the middle.

Jesper

--
MacBook Pro, 8GB, OS 10.9.3,
Sibelius 7.5, Wallander Intstruments Brass & Woodwind 2.37,
Wallander Intstruments NotePerformer 1.3.3,
EZDrummer 2.01 + Jazz EZX 1.5.1, Pianoteq Pro 5.01, Acoustic Samples The Upright
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Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff Spacing, and Lines
Posted by Robin Walker - 25 Aug 09:11PM
Interesting about the trill line! However, Sibelius still treats it as a trill for playback purposes (which can of course be turned off), and for magnetic layout properties.

It does appear that there are some Line Styles which can hold staves apart, and some which cannot. Brackets don't work, while Pedal lines do work. It seems that, if there is any setting for this effect, it is not one exposed to us mere mortals.

Thanks for a potential solution!

--
Sibelius 7.5.1/7.1.3/6.2/5.2.5, PhotoScore Ult 7.0.2, Dolet 6.3 for Sibelius, Windows 7 32-bit SP1, 4GB RAM
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Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff Spacing, and Lines
Posted by Richard Vitale - 25 Aug 09:29PM
Yes Jesper,

Good one!

I almost tried a trill line but assumed it was the horizontal spacing of the character that caused the optimization.

If is not the "width" but the "property" of the line (as Robin stated) in this case that determines whether or not optimization occurs since the trill line is no more wider horizontally than an 8vb line, which has no effect on optimization.

I can't get the dashed or dotted line to show up on the trill when creating a New Line. What am I missing here?

--
Richie Vitale-Sib 7.1.3 User
iMac 2.66 Ghz Intel/Lion/4 GB RAM
http://www.richievitale.com
http://www.youtube.com/user/richievitale
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Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff Spacing, and Lines
Posted by Robin Walker - 25 Aug 09:38PM
Richard, I wonder if you have "horizontal" and "vertical" swapped in some of your posts?

--
Sibelius 7.5.1/7.1.3/6.2/5.2.5, PhotoScore Ult 7.0.2, Dolet 6.3 for Sibelius, Windows 7 32-bit SP1, 4GB RAM
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Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff Spacing, and Lines
Posted by Richard Vitale - 25 Aug 10:26PM (edited 25 Aug 10:26PM)
Probably, confusion between vertical/horizontal . . . add that to "fear of heights" and slight dyslexia along with misspelling "Crescendo" as "Crecsendo" :-)

Here's a Line for Dotted Crescendo I made I believe from a Pedal Line.
(Weird thing is I can't search for it in the Sib search box.)

Of course no one in their right mind (besides me) would like the font and a hook can't be applied to this but and arrow can, from my short exploration.

The "Symbol" I use was created as a Graphic about a year ago and there is a larger default one called Barline under "Repeats" and a smaller one called Battement under "More Ornaments" but these weren't right.

You'll see I used this to make my own "Dashed Line" (with no writing before it) in Sibelius.

The Dashed, Pedal and Trill Lines are still in this Score just for experimenting.

--
Richie Vitale-Sib 7.1.3 User
iMac 2.66 Ghz Intel/Lion/4 GB RAM
http://www.richievitale.com
http://www.youtube.com/user/richievitale
Attachments Cres Line.sib (98K), Crescendo Dotted Line.png (87K)
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Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff Spacing, and Lines
Posted by Jesper Elén - 26 Aug 05:22AM (edited 26 Aug 07:27AM)
I tried first to make a new line from dotted line and to make line and misc. line become part of the dynamics group in the magnetic layout window. It ought to be some setting in magnetic layout if it's not hard wired but could not get that to work.

Jesper

p.s. I love trying to solve little mysteries like this. ; - )

--
MacBook Pro, 8GB, OS 10.9.3,
Sibelius 7.5, Wallander Intstruments Brass & Woodwind 2.37,
Wallander Intstruments NotePerformer 1.3.3,
EZDrummer 2.01 + Jazz EZX 1.5.1, Pianoteq Pro 5.01, Acoustic Samples The Upright
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Messages in this thread

Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff Spaci... - Robin Walker, 24 Aug 05:49PM
     Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff S... - Richard Vitale, 24 Aug 07:52PM
         Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff S... - Jesper Elén, 25 Aug 05:25PM
             Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff S... - Robin Walker, 25 Aug 09:11PM
                 Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff S... - Richard Vitale, 25 Aug 09:29PM
                     Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff S... - Robin Walker, 25 Aug 09:38PM
                         Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff S... - Richard Vitale, 25 Aug 10:26PM
                             Re: Sib. 7.5: Magnetic Layout, Optimize Staff S... - Jesper Elén, 26 Aug 05:22AM