'Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???'

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Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triple... - Patience, 15 Oct 03:53AM
     Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Steven Edis, 15 Oct 07:29AM
         Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Mike Lyons, 15 Oct 07:52AM
             Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Laurence Payne, 15 Oct 10:25AM
                 Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Patience, 16 Oct 06:06PM
                     Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Roy Moore, 16 Oct 07:22PM
                         Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Patience, 16 Oct 07:40PM
                             Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Laurence Payne, 16 Oct 08:02PM
                                 Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Patience, 16 Oct 11:40PM
                                     Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Patience, 16 Oct 11:43PM
                                         Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Patience, 16 Oct 11:47PM
                                             Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Steven Edis, 16 Oct 11:56PM
                                                 Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Laurence Payne, 17 Oct 12:27AM
                                                     Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Patience, 17 Oct 01:57AM
                                                         Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Laurence Payne, 17 Oct 07:13AM
                                                     Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Steven Edis, 17 Oct 08:46AM
                                                         Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Patience, 20 Oct 06:56PM
                                                             Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Laurence Payne, 20 Oct 08:43PM
                                                                 Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Patience, 20 Oct 09:33PM

Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???
Posted by Patience - 15 Oct 03:53AM
I want to play the piano accompaniment for the children's choir at Christmas of O Holy Night (Adolphe Adam). I need to transpose it and I thought I could just key it in (still can't figure out FlexiTime or whatever it's called - after all these years) - so I use my PC keyboard and key in the notes.

Here's the problem. I don't know how to do those joined triplets. The time signature is Common time and my theory isn't that terrific even though I can play the piece :-) but there are two sets grouped together with a rounded bracket(?) below each set of 6 notes and the triplet number (3) is below the 2nd note and the 5th notes in each set. I hope this makes sense.

How in the world do I create that? I tried various things under tuplets and joining tuplets but it's like these are joined triplets. ARGH!!

Any help is greatly appreciated. I can manually transpose the piece but it sure would be better to do it in Sibelius (actually it would be unbelievably great to finally get flexitime to work properly with the laptop to the Yamaha keyboard but that's too much to think about right now.

Thanks so much,
Nancy

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Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???
Posted by Steven Edis - 15 Oct 07:29AM
Hi Nancy

Are you sure you want to have rounded brackets? Sib won't do this very willingly, though you can fake it with slurs. It's not considered good practice nowadays - there was a thread on the forum on this very subject a few days ago. You might want to search it.

As for joining the two sets of triplets together, the simplest way is to engage the 3rd keypad (F10), then select the note just after where you want the join (in your example the 4th chord in each set of 6) and hit '8' on the numeric keypad. [for a fuller explanation look up 'beams' in the manual]

If as a result you find unwanted square brackets appearing on your triplets, I'm afraid you will have to re-create the triplets by doing Create>Tuplet... and selecting 'no bracket'. I think you only have to go via this screen once and then the setting will hold when you create subsequent triplets via the much quicker 'Ctrl+3'.

But you say "my theory isn't that terrific even though I can play the piece" - so why make life so hard for yourself getting hung up on the niceties of the notation? You're not going to play it any differently in the new key just because the triplets aren't joined? ;-)

Best wishes
Steve




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Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???
Posted by Mike Lyons - 15 Oct 07:52AM
Forgive me if I'm wrong, but it sounds much more likely to me that the quavers are grouped into triplets, without brackets, and SLURRED over/under each group of 2 triplets. If I were doing this, I would put the triplets in with 'sticky triplets and then select them all and remove brackets in one fell swoop.

--
1.6GHz Intel i7 Quad core, Win 7 Pro (x64), 8GB, 450GB + 6TB HDD, Blu-Ray, Edirol SD-20, Focusrite Scarlett 6i6, Sib 6.2, 7.1.3 EWQLSO Plat, Miroslav Phil.
Si me castigare vis, necesse est me intellexisse.

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Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???
Posted by Laurence Payne - 15 Oct 10:25AM
I think you're looking at joined pairs of triplets with no brackets, plus a slur.

But it doesn't matter if the triplets are joined, does it? You're making a copy to aid your transposed performance, not preparing a fascimile edition!

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Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???
Posted by Patience - 16 Oct 06:06PM
Hi All -
Mike - I believe you're rightr - no brackets and a slur under the grouping of 2 sets of triplets. Let me see if I can find "sticky triplets" in the Sibelius manual. Thank you.

Laurence and Steven - you are both so right. :-)

~Nancy

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Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???
Posted by Roy Moore - 16 Oct 07:22PM (edited 16 Oct 07:26PM)

-- Sticky tuplets was a new feature in Sib 7


Roy Moore
London UK
Sib 7.1.3,Windows 7 SP 1 pro x64 8gb ram,2x quad core 2.5ghz , 512gb SSD Audiophile 2496
EW Goliath, EWQLSO platinum, Hollywood Strings gold




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Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???
Posted by Patience - 16 Oct 07:40PM
Ah that's what my sticky fingers can't find it. I'm still using 6 (and still trying to figure out all the features!

I'm getting there but I still couldn't figure out how to join the 2 sets of triplets and I've still a ways to go putting in all the notes but I'll attach what I have so far.

Thanks so much!
Nancy
Attachment O Holy Night Piano & Voice.sib (34K)

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Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???
Posted by Laurence Payne - 16 Oct 08:02PM
See attached screenshot. The indicated note should be selected, then press the indicated key on Keypad Layout 3.

I suggest you leave out the triplet numbers after the first bar. It's perfectly clear how the rhythm continues, and they only clutter the page.
Attachment Capture.JPG.jpg (98K)

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Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???
Posted by Patience - 16 Oct 11:40PM
Laurence - that was terrific. Thank you. Phew! I tried to remove the "3" however it removed the notes as well so I'm not sure how else to delete them. Any suggestions?

Thanks again.
Nancy
Attachment O Holy Night Piano & Voice.sib (34K)

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Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???
Posted by Patience - 16 Oct 11:43PM
Drats - I clicked the "Save" icon but it didn't save it so I'm going to make those changes again and attach the file one more time. Sorry about that.

~Nancy

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Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???
Posted by Patience - 16 Oct 11:47PM (edited 17 Oct 01:51AM)
Ok - made those changes again, saved the file, closed it out, opened it up and it still had the changes and now I'll attach it here.

Thanks,
Nancy

Perfect! It saved the changes.
Attachment O Holy Night Piano & Voice.sib (34K)

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Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???
Posted by Steven Edis - 16 Oct 11:56PM
To remove the "3"s, don't delete them, just hide them (Ctrl+Shift+H)

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Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???
Posted by Laurence Payne - 17 Oct 12:27AM (edited 17 Oct 12:31AM)
It's even easier than that! Select the whole piece except the first bar. In Properties/Notes, under the word "Tuplet" select "None". All tuplet numbers will disappear.

Probably easier to select EVERYTHING with Ctrl-A, turn tuplet numbers off, then select bar 1 and turn them on again for just that bar.

And don't forget the invaluable "R for Repeat" function. Having entered one group of 6 notes, select them and press R. It's a lot quicker to change the pitches to what they should be than to set up another pair of joined triplets.

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Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???
Posted by Patience - 17 Oct 01:57AM
AHHHHHHH....said with much gratefulness Laurence.

As for the "R" repeat function, I didn't know about that. I've been simply doing a copy and paste (Ctl-C and Ctl-V). Is the "R" any easier? Kind of sounds like the same thing?

Thanks so so so much!
Nancy

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Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???
Posted by Laurence Payne - 17 Oct 07:13AM
When R does what you need, I suppose it's slightly quicker. There are quite a few copy/paste methods.

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Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???
Posted by Steven Edis - 17 Oct 08:46AM

"It's even easier than that! Select the whole piece except the first bar. In Properties/Notes, under the word "Tuplet" select "None". All tuplet numbers will disappear."

Genius! I'd never spotted that that was there! You live and learn...

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Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???
Posted by Patience - 20 Oct 06:56PM
Ok All - I've completed the piece and have not played it myself not have I reviewed it all but I wanted to see what you thought. I know I probably don't do the text correctly, nor spacing of staves, etc. :-(

Where do I go to insert the dynamic text (i.e. mp, f, etc.)?

Thanks for all your help and support.

Nancy
Attachment O Holy Night Piano & Voice.sib (44K)

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Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???
Posted by Laurence Payne - 20 Oct 08:43PM
Well done!
Some of the phrase marks have gone a bit awry! I suggest you delete them and start over. Select the first note of the phrase, hit S (for Slur) then keep hitting to extend the line.

You want Expression Text for the dynamics. Press Ctrl-E, click the text cursor into place. Then R-click to open the gallery of dynamic etc. markings.

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Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triplets???
Posted by Patience - 20 Oct 09:33PM
Laurence - Thanks! I'll go back and edit those slurs per your great suggestion.

One thing I should have thought of was that this was all done to transpose the key to A flat (for the kids) for this accompaniment is terribly low. :-( Well at least I have it at the ready in case there's ever a need to play in a higher key :-)

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Messages in this thread

Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those triple... - Patience, 15 Oct 03:53AM
     Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Steven Edis, 15 Oct 07:29AM
         Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Mike Lyons, 15 Oct 07:52AM
             Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Laurence Payne, 15 Oct 10:25AM
                 Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Patience, 16 Oct 06:06PM
                     Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Roy Moore, 16 Oct 07:22PM
                         Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Patience, 16 Oct 07:40PM
                             Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Laurence Payne, 16 Oct 08:02PM
                                 Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Patience, 16 Oct 11:40PM
                                     Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Patience, 16 Oct 11:43PM
                                         Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Patience, 16 Oct 11:47PM
                                             Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Steven Edis, 16 Oct 11:56PM
                                                 Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Laurence Payne, 17 Oct 12:27AM
                                                     Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Patience, 17 Oct 01:57AM
                                                         Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Laurence Payne, 17 Oct 07:13AM
                                                     Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Steven Edis, 17 Oct 08:46AM
                                                         Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Patience, 20 Oct 06:56PM
                                                             Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Laurence Payne, 20 Oct 08:43PM
                                                                 Re: Sib. 6.x: Sib 6: O Holy Night....O those tr... - Patience, 20 Oct 09:33PM