Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by John Gries - 06 Apr 08:25AM Hide picture Is there any way to produce noteheads that bear the syllable letter (moveable DO)? Finale 2011 does this with its "FinaleAlphaFonts". I see that there is a Sibelius plug-in that allows the addition of note letter names, but I find no way to do the same thing with solfege initials (D, R, M, etc.). There is a product out there called "Kidnotes", but that appears to work with Sibelius 3 and 4 only. Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Bob Zawalich - 06 Apr 08:48AM Hide picture To my knowledge, there is no way to do this at present. You would need a font, comparable to the Finale font, (perhaps you could even use that font, if you had Finale 2011 installed on your machine), and you would also need to have a mechanism that would select the appropriate notehead based on the note pitch. The plugin Add Note Names to Noteheads does that for the A B C D E F noteheads, but that is a rather simpler task than determining the position of the note in its scale, which would be required for this case. That is, in fact, not all that hard, either, but there is no published plugin I am aware of that can do that. Not to mention the lack of a font. I do note that Plugins > Text > Add Note Names can add the name of a pitch in text above the note, and it can use French or Spanish Do Re Mi notation, though it is fixed Do, not moveable. (see screenshot). Plugins > Text > Add Tonic Sol-Fa adds text below the notes, but does use moveable do. It has its own issues, as you can read in the Reference. In the end, though, to do what you want in Sibelius would require access to a font with the required letters, and probably a new plugin to match the noteheads with the scale positions. At the moment neither of these are available. Good luck! -- Bob Sib 1.2 - 6.2, Windows 7 Pro 64 bit, 2.13 GHz Core 2 Duo; Audiophile 2496; 4 G RAM. Year 2011. I am an experienced Sibelius user, but am not affiliated with Sibelius Software. Sib Plugin downloads: www.sibelius.com/download/plugins (see How to Install Plugins; use Vista for Windows 7) Alphabetical plugin list: www.bobzawalich.com/AllPluginsOnDownloadPage.htm Attachment Snap1.png (16K) Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Bob Zawalich - 06 Apr 08:56AM Hide picture From googling, I see that the KidNotes font is still available and that it includes RSMLT noteheads, so that could probably be used for the font. The Sibelius Opus Note Name font includes A - F and accidentals within them, but not the other letters, so it could not be used for this purpose. -- Bob Sib 1.2 - 6.2, Windows 7 Pro 64 bit, 2.13 GHz Core 2 Duo; Audiophile 2496; 4 G RAM. Year 2011. I am an experienced Sibelius user, but am not affiliated with Sibelius Software. Sib Plugin downloads: www.sibelius.com/download/plugins (see How to Install Plugins; use Vista for Windows 7) Alphabetical plugin list: www.bobzawalich.com/AllPluginsOnDownloadPage.htm Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Lukihir - 13 May 04:17AM Hide picture Thank very much for all your kind help! I guess I should have purchased Finale instead of Sibelius. Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Bob Zawalich - 13 May 08:16AM Hide picture That may or may not be true. Each program has its strong points, and may work better than the other in so=me situations. Now that you own Sibelius, you can get a crossgrade to Finale if you really want to go there. I do notice that in MuseScore 2 (which is a free open source program), there is a plugin called Add Named Noteheads that has a lot of options, including solfege names. It could be worth a look. -- Bob An experienced user of Sibelius. Sib 1.2 - 7.5, Windows 7 Pro SP 1 64 bit, 4 G RAM. Year 2015. Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Kai Struck - 13 May 09:23AM Hide picture I think it's also a good idea to look at how often you need it. If it's only sometimes you can put the text over the notehead by hand and copy passages. If you need it regularly then of course this would be tedious. Easier for the eyes is text above the notes IMHO. The musescore plugin Bob mentioned also puts text on front of the noteheads: https://musescore.org/en/project/addnotenameheads Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Lukihir - 14 May 05:01AM (edited 14 May 05:26AM) Hide picture Thanks for the tips! Having listen to friends and colleagues gripe incessantly, about finale, I have become well aware of its shortcomings. I bought Sibelius after all the raves and testimonials, so perhaps my expectations were higher than they would have been otherwise. I am still perolexed that they would include so many options for noteheads and at the same time omit something as universal as solfege. Thanks again for all the great tips. Musescore sounds promissing. A substantial percentage of my clients are Latino and were thus raised on fixed do. With begining students, I have to meet them halfway at first, and that often means having to dance the Do si do to keep them happy and engaged. Thanks again, Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Kai Struck - 14 May 02:29PM Hide picture I looked closer into it in hope to find an easy solution but there is no. The only idea would be to use another font (you can set the Notename font in Sibelius' Preferences) but this has no effect on the plugin: It always uses OpusNoteNamesStd.otf I would even say the Notename head feature isn't very useful at all because the fonts are transparent so Notenames like "F" or "E" (or "Re" are hardly readable because of the stafflines going right through the middle "strokes" of these characters. And who wants to always have to use colored Notes? The KidNoteheads look quite good but is unlikely to work in Sib6: http://tomrudolph.berkleemusicblogs.com/2008/09/17/printing-note-names-inside-noteheads/ Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Bob Zawalich - 14 May 05:31PM (edited 14 May 05:32PM) Hide picture In Sibelius 7, we solved the transparent notehead problem by generating the noteheads using SVG graphics rather than fonts. These are opaque and hide the staff lines. So while this does not address the solfege issue it does look better. Prior to Sib 7, I wrote the plugin Add Note Names To Noteheads White, which in on the download page at http://www.sibelius.com/download/plugins/index.html?plugin=208. It creates notes that are colored while and then overlays notehead symbols over them, which will hide the staff lines as well. It has issues if you change the pitches, but so does the regular plugin since the letter names do not adapt when the pitch changes. This is essentially what the MuseScore plugin does, by the way, though it will handle various forms of solfege as well, as long as Do Re Mi are acceptable. A truly ambitious person who only cared about fixed do solfege might redefine all the notehead symbols using different SVG graphhics symbols, and then the Sib 7 plugin would work OK. At this point, if I had to do it I would just do it in MuseScore 2. I attach screenshots of the Sib plugins to show the whiteout effect, and a shot of the MuseScore plugin output. By default, it puts the notenames below the notes; there is an option to shift the vertical spacing but I haven;t really figured it out; if is just here to suggest a possibility. I dragged a couple of the "symbols" onto the noteheads as an exampole. -- Bob An experienced user of Sibelius. Sib 1.2 - 7.5, Windows 7 Pro SP 1 64 bit, 4 G RAM. Year 2015. Attachments snap1.png (77K), snap2.png (34K) Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Ralph L. Bowers Jr. - 14 May 06:27PM Hide picture I would imagine a plugin writer could create one for MuseScore that would move the solfege to each notehead. -- Sibelius 6.2, 7.1.3, 7.5.1, Bob Zawalich plugins, NotePerformer 1.4.2c, dolet 6.4 (update 10-3-2014) Finale 2010b,2011b,2012c, 2014d, TGTools pro, Patterson plugins, JW Plugins, GPO4, World Instruments MuseScore 2 (seeing what's out there) ProTools 9.5, Reaper Notion 4, Notion 5 (bought but not installed), Progression, Progression 2, Progression 3 Windows XP Pro (32 bit); 2@ 7 Pro (64bit); 8.1 Pro (64 bit)/ 4-16GB Ram across four PC's Pencil & Paper Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Bob Zawalich - 14 May 07:05PM Hide picture > I would imagine a plugin writer could create one for MuseScore that would move the solfege to each notehead. Yes - the note names seem horizontally aligned and there is a vertical adjustment in the dialog, so I imagine the offset is intentional. I have only tinkered with MuseScore a bit and haven't yet found a setting that aligns vertically exactly. But it does look promising. -- Bob An experienced user of Sibelius. Sib 1.2 - 7.5, Windows 7 Pro SP 1 64 bit, 4 G RAM. Year 2015. Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Kai Struck - 14 May 08:29PM Hide picture Bob, I'm using Sibelius 7.1.3 in german language and am not getting white outed noteheads from the shipped plugin called "Notennamen in Notenköpfe schreiben". Tested now: When using Sibelius in english the shipped plugin "Add Note Names To Noteheads" does indeed white out the background. Where are the SVG graphics stored that work in english but not in german?? Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Bob Zawalich - 14 May 10:13PM Hide picture The SVG graphics are in the Symbol table at the bottom in the group "Note Names". I am not sure why the German version would be any different in this regard, unless the plugin did not get updated in that version. I just checked and the text of the shipping 7.1 plugins in both English and German looks OK to me, so I doubt that is an issue. However, the plugin does import a House Style, Opus Note Names.lib, and I do note that the English .lib file is larger than any of the non English ones. That might mean that they were not updated and are still referencing the font. I don;t have any tools to examine the House Style files, so I can't really say if they are correct, but you could do what I did above, and look in the symbol table and see if the symbols are SVG graphics in the German version. That still may not answer the question though. -- Bob An experienced user of Sibelius. Sib 1.2 - 7.5, Windows 7 Pro SP 1 64 bit, 4 G RAM. Year 2015. Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Kai Struck - 14 May 11:05PM (edited 14 May 11:08PM) Hide picture In german Sibelius the notename symbols in the Symbol Palette are transparent fonts. In english Sibelius the notename symbols in the Symbol Palette are SVG graphics. If I replace the german Opus Note Names.lib (95kb) with the english version (121kb) then the german plugin uses the SVG graphics. These SVG graphics then show up in the Symbol Palette as "user defined". So the SVG graphics are stored in the english Opus Note Names.lib. I hoped they were stored somewhere externally. Then it would have been easy to edit them eg. to Do Re Mi etc. Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Kai Struck - 15 May 06:13PM Hide picture How should solfege noteheads be named? D R M F S L T Do Re Mi Fa Sol La Si Do Re Mi Fa Sol La Ti Do we need Do# or Reb? Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Bob Zawalich - 15 May 07:51PM Hide picture (Sorry Kai, I wrote this up last night, so it may not answer your questions properly, but they answers may be in here...) Actually, for naming you have to decide how much space you will need for visibility. D will be more visible than Do. MuseScore uses Do but slants the text. They have an option for Ti or Si. You would want both. Musescore uses the same name for notes with accidentals (Cb, C#, and C are all Do). When I studied solfege there were names for sharp and flat letters for each syllable. I suppose you would do whatever your system preferred. (The original post) The plugin looks to see if certain notehead symbols are defined in the score; if not it imports the House Style. (Neil Sands wrote the original plugin, not me, so some details are fuzzier than usual). The notehead styles are defined only if the plugin has been run, since the plugin uses up 30 or so notehead styles and there are only 64 available styles. These are the notehead style names, in the English version. NoteheadStyles { "Note names (A flat)" "Note names (A)" "Note names (A sharp)" "Note names (B flat)" "Note names (B)" "Note names (B sharp)" "Note names (C flat)" "Note names (C)" "Note names (C sharp)" "Note names (D flat)" "Note names (D)" "Note names (D sharp)" "Note names (E flat)" "Note names (E)" "Note names (E sharp)" "Note names (F flat)" "Note names (F)" "Note names (F sharp)" "Note names (G flat)" "Note names (G)" "Note names (G sharp)" } In German, the list is the same. So the definitions of the NOTEHEAD styles will always come from the House Style file Opus Note Names.lib, and these appear to be English names.. The Notehead styles refer to Symbol definitions, and the SVG graphics symbols will always be predefined in a new Sib 7 score. You can see them in the Note Names group at the bottom of the symbol table. Daniel defined these symbols (and created them personally) in the Sib 7 beat cycle, when I became a bit obsessed with using graphics to finally make these notehead opaque. We also thought it would be a good use-case for having graphics based symbols. In German scores, these symbols have German names, so someone went to a fair bit of manual labor to names these all in all the languages (or at least in German). This is especially labor intensive when you realizre the plugin is the only thing that uses these and it keeps the notehead style names in English. If you run the plugin in English, and then look in Edit Noteheads for one of the note names notehead styles and click on Add Symbol for one of the symbols, the English version of the notehead styles refer to SVG graphics symbols. My guess is that the German and other non-English versions did not get an updated Opus Note Name.lib file and their notehead styles reference the older font-based symbols, which will be loaded when the House Style is imported. So indeed, if you run the German plugin, you will see a second set of user-defined font-derived symbols, and these will be transparent, as font characters always are. To fix this someone would have to rebuild Opus Note Name.lib for the various languages. To get Do Re Mi the right way, one could create a new set of SVG symbols with all the letters with accidentals in the various durations used by noteheads, and then change the plugin to have options for letter names or solfege, in fixed and moveable Do. Then the Opus Note Names.lib could be updated to include all these new Notehead Styles. And this could be translated into all the languages. And then you would run smack into the limit of 64 notehead styles in a score, which the plugin is already pushing, and which is unlikely to ever be fixed. So that will never happen. So if you were obsessive enough to want to get these in Sibelius now (and remember, you could accomplish this in MuseScore right now withoiut doing all this work, and the best you will get is Sibelius is fixed do), you could find the set of symbols that the plugin in your language uses (by running the plugin and then examining the Notehead styles), figure out the names they use, create an entire set of SVG graphics symbols with Do Re Mi, or D, R, M, and replace the symbols in the symbol table that correspond to the A, B, C, etc. names. You will need to figure out a reasonable way to name notes with accidentals. So basically you substitute your symbols for the ones the plugin uses. Then you export a house style containing those symbols. After all this, you run the plugin, which will use the A B C symbols, then you import your house style, then you run the plugin again, and voila, you should have your new symbols. Piece of cake, huh? Not really much crazier than what Daniel and I did, but you need to really want it. Now, if I could just figure out a way to color notes in chords separately... -- Bob An experienced user of Sibelius. Sib 1.2 - 7.5, Windows 7 Pro SP 1 64 bit, 4 G RAM. Year 2015. Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Kai Struck - 16 May 01:36AM (edited 16 May 01:40AM) Hide picture Bob, thank you for your very detailed explanation. This is and was very helpful. I must confess that I'm a little bit too lazy to invest much time in this project but for a start I created a housestyle that one can import and then run the "Add Note Names to Noteheads" plugin. It is called SimpleSolfeggioTi.lib as it only adds D R M F S L T wihout half tones. I have all the Inkscape SVG sources to share, if one want them. For now the Housestyle (for Sib7) can be downloaded here: https://goo.gl/YE2vCK If someone really really needs a Sol Si version, then I might create one Attachment SimpleSolfeggioTi - Installation and Usage.jpg (184K) Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Kai Struck - 16 May 09:51PM Hide picture Bob, to color separate notes in chords I think it isn't possible with normal coloring. But like with shaped noteheads one could make predefined colored graphic noteheads. Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Bob Zawalich - 16 May 10:37PM Hide picture If you had specific colors you always wanted, and could keep the total number of noteheads down to about the limit of 64, colored special noteheads would be a fine idea. For my uses, it would be too limiting. I have a plugin I use that splits chords into separate voices so the notes can be colored, but it is really a poor workaround. I have asked for the ability to color noteheads separately in chords for years, and it never made it to the list of things to be fixed. BTW, you scheme for the solfege noteheads seems a good one. Since you have defined the notehead styles and symbols and put them into a house style, you could even have a plugin import the house style and then have it run the Add Names plugin, and you can make it look as though it is a single step to the user. Nicely done! -- Bob An experienced user of Sibelius. Sib 1.2 - 7.5, Windows 7 Pro SP 1 64 bit, 4 G RAM. Year 2015. Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Kai Struck - 16 May 10:56PM Hide picture Thanks for the hint with the plugin calling another plugin. I haven't looked much into manuscript yet. Do you need lots of colors for your plugin? I have made 3 Inkscape SVGs out of whole,half and quarter Opus Notes that makes it easy to create any colored Notehead. Unlike the solfeggio noteheads that must be at least 3x7 noteheads style for all tones colored only take one style per color, not? Attachment coloredNoteheadsGreen.png (2K) Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Bob Zawalich - 17 May 04:13AM Hide picture Hi Kai, Yes - if you stick to normal notehead shapes in, say, Opus font, then, while you would need 3 symbols for each Notehead Style, you will only need 1 style for a given color. If you are willing to make up some symbols for me, I could probably do something interesting with some color plugins. I will contact you off-list with some details. Thanks -- Bob An experienced user of Sibelius. Sib 1.2 - 7.5, Windows 7 Pro SP 1 64 bit, 4 G RAM. Year 2015. Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Kai Struck - 17 May 10:58AM Hide picture Yes, you can conract me by email. Although already having made the Opus SVGs I think it's a better idea to take the Bravura Noteheads (for not getting bound too much). Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Robin Walker - 17 May 08:30AM Hide picture > I have asked for the ability to color noteheads separately in chords for years, > and it never made it to the list of things to be fixed. Maybe this has something to do with it: https://cases.justia.com/federal/district-courts/massachusetts/madce/1:2011cv11472/138606/55/0.pdf -- Sibelius 7.5.1/7.1.3/6.2/5.2.5, PhotoScore Ult 7.0.2, Dolet 6.3 for Sibelius, Windows 7 32-bit SP1 4GB, Windows 8.1 64-bit 16GB. Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Bob Zawalich - 17 May 09:04AM Hide picture Interesting, Robin. I knew that the Pitch Spectrum feature had been removed in Sib 6 because of some legal action, but never got any details. It seems to me that the claim for the patent was to prevent coloring pitches based on the circle of fifths. Even without considering that relating colors to pitches has a fairly ancient lineage,it is not clear to me that the patent would prohibit coloring notes according to pitches altogether. At any rate, Sib still does allow you to color notes, and there are at least plugins that will color according to pitch. The issue I have had, and still have, is that if you apply a color to a NoteRest object, which can be a rest, a single note, an interval or a chord, is that the color applied to the NoteRest affects all Note objects in a chord or interval. So I suspect that the lawsuit is not what prevented Sib from letting us color individual notes. Not being a lawyer, I was not quite sure what the linked to paper really said - was Avid trying to dismiss the lawsuit, and the dismissal denied? I wonder if the lawsuit was ever fully resolved, and if the patent actually gives the holder the right to payment for anything that assigns colors to pitches. I would imagine that Finale and MuseScore and many other notation programs would have the same issues - MuseScore has a plugin to color notes ina Boomwhackers pattern, and I have downloadable plugins that will color each pitch an arbitrary color, with a "spectrum" default. -- Bob An experienced user of Sibelius. Sib 1.2 - 7.5, Windows 7 Pro SP 1 64 bit, 4 G RAM. Year 2015. Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Robin Walker - 17 May 09:38AM Hide picture > was Avid trying to dismiss the lawsuit, and the dismissal denied? Yes, that's my understanding. Also available in the public domain are reports of other hearings in the same action. -- Sibelius 7.5.1/7.1.3/6.2/5.2.5, PhotoScore Ult 7.0.2, Dolet 6.3 for Sibelius, Windows 7 32-bit SP1 4GB, Windows 8.1 64-bit 16GB. Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Bob Zawalich - 22 May 12:04AM Hide picture While poking around the internet, I came across this, which has a chart purporting to show various mappings of pitches and colors, starting with Isaac Newton. Obviously the basic concept of such a mapping is not a new idea. http://rhythmiclight.com/archives/ideas/colorscales.html -- Bob An experienced user of Sibelius. Sib 1.2 - 7.5, Windows 7 Pro SP 1 64 bit, 4 G RAM. Year 2015. Back to top | All threads

Re: Sib. 6.2: Solfege noteheads Posted by Vaclav Muller - 11 Sep 07:51PM Hide picture Thank you for the help. I just edited the SVG files. Here's my version: http://goo.gl/pZoaYi Back to top | All threads