'Brass and percussion notation'

Messages in this thread

Brass and percussion notation - vln/vla/cello player, 21 Feb 08:27PM
     Re: Brass and percussion notation - Richard Vitale, 21 Feb 09:28PM
     Re: Brass and percussion notation - Laurence Payne, 21 Feb 10:30PM
         Re: Brass and percussion notation - vln/vla/cello player, 22 Feb 07:03PM
             Re: Brass and percussion notation - Daniel Spreadbury, 22 Feb 07:13PM
                 Re: Brass and percussion notation - vln/vla/cello player, 22 Feb 10:36PM
                     Re: Brass and percussion notation - Jason Dwyer, 23 Feb 03:26AM
                         Re: Brass and percussion notation - Daniel Spreadbury, 23 Feb 09:41AM

Brass and percussion notation
Posted by vln/vla/cello player - 21 Feb 08:27PM
How do you notate what mutes a trumpet should use, and what affects can they have on the sound? I noticed on one of our orchestra's pieces the trumpeter was using something similar to the rubber bell of a bathroom plunger to do a "waa-waa" sound, and a different kind was used for the horse whinny in "Sleigh Ride".

What part of a drum kit or set is played on the lines and spaces Sibelius uses? When I asked some of my professional colleagues, they said there is no standard and it is indicated on their score what instrument plays what note.

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Re: Brass and percussion notation
Posted by Richard Vitale - 21 Feb 09:28PM (edited 21 Feb 09:31PM)
The straight mute sound is best know from the Duke's song "Take the A Train":
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnurVNkg62Q&feature=related

heard in the first 2 A-sections

(Though you can't see the trumpets with the mutes in, I hear it.)
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The harmon mute is synonymous with Miles Davis "Round about Midnight" recording.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=td3SE3zEVP0

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The #5 (size) toilet plunger is used here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qDQpZT3GhDg&feature=related

This is preferred to the red and white store-bought "hats" that are more for show than for sound.

The whinny sound is made by playing a shake while dropping from a high note to a lower one while opening the aperture between mute and trumpet bell.

(I use the plunger for both the wah-wah and the whinny sound, so ask your trumpeter colleague about using different mutes for each effect.)

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And my late great friend Art Farmer with a cup mute.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LY9nrbr4w1I

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To notate which mute is to be used, simply write in the parts:
straight mute, harmon mute, or plunger mute.

Specific instructions can be written in also regarding the mute and/or explained to the player.

Write in OPEN or OPEN MUTE when you'd like the mute taken out.
(It's good to write this in way before the mute is to be relinquished and also, at the actual point where it is taken out, just as you would do for a flute switching to tenor for examlle, two warnings are usually given.)

Always give the trumpet a bar or two to put in a mute. Occasionally, in orchestra situation, the mute could be kept on the trumpeter's lap for a quick entrance but I regard this as an unsafe procedure.

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See attached score for Sibelius Drum Notation.

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Richie Vitale-Sib 6.1 User
iMac 2.66 Ghz Intel/Snow Leopard
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http://www.myspace.com/richievitale
Attachment Drum Sounds.sib (31K)

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Re: Brass and percussion notation
Posted by Laurence Payne - 21 Feb 10:30PM
On Sun, 21 Feb 2010 20:27:37, "vln/vla/cello player"
<az.violist@att.net> wrote:

>How do you notate what mutes a trumpet should use, and what affects can they have
>on the sound? I noticed on one of our orchestra's pieces the trumpeter was using
>something similar to the rubber bell of a bathroom plunger to do a "waa-waa" sound,
>and a different kind was used for the horse whinny in "Sleigh Ride".

You write "Straight Mute", "Harmon Mute", "Harmon (tube out)", "Cup
Mute", "Plunger" etc. over the score. If the "waa" effect is wanted,
use the same o and + over the note that you'd use for open and closed
hi-hat. As to the effect - you'll find plenty of information on
instruments, arranging and orchestration by Googling around a bit.
Don't expect Sibelius to notice anything more than "Muted" and "Open"
in playback though, unless you install a specialist sound set.

>
>What part of a drum kit or set is played on the lines and spaces Sibelius uses?
>When I asked some of my professional colleagues, they said there is no standard
>and it is indicated on their score what instrument plays what note.

Thinking treble clef, you're quite safe in notating F=bass drum,
C=snare drum. Hi-hat and cymbals go at the top of the stave or just
above it using cross-heads. It's slightly variable which line or
space they take, but it's a fair bet that the lower note will be HH,
next up ride then crash.

The notation used by Sibelius' default drum sets is as good as any. Go
with that, add an indication anywhere ambiguity is possible.

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Re: Brass and percussion notation
Posted by vln/vla/cello player - 22 Feb 07:03PM
Sorry, but what version of Sibelius was the Drum Sounds file done in? My program said it was unable to open it and I should check for updates, but the website says I have the most updated version.

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Re: Brass and percussion notation
Posted by Daniel Spreadbury - 22 Feb 07:13PM
That score was created in Sibelius 6. Do you perhaps have Sibelius 5?

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Re: Brass and percussion notation
Posted by vln/vla/cello player - 22 Feb 10:36PM
No, I've got Sibelius 4. That might be out of date, but I am mainly using it for some transcribing and arranging, so I didn't see much point in upgrading the program. Would I have to buy Sibelius 6 as a seperate program, or can 4 be upgraded for a lower price?

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Re: Brass and percussion notation
Posted by Jason Dwyer - 23 Feb 03:26AM
That's what I did was upgrade from 4 to 6, and yes, thankfully, upgrading is less expensive than buying 6 separately.

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Re: Brass and percussion notation
Posted by Daniel Spreadbury - 23 Feb 09:41AM
Depending on whether you have the educational or professional version of Sibelius, the upgrade price differs, but it is considerably less than buying the software outright again. To find out which upgrade you are eligible for, type your serial number into the form here:

https://account.avid.com/upgrades/upgrade.cfm

--
Contact Sibelius technical help:
USA & Canada: sibhelpUSA@sibelius.com / 1-888-280-9995
UK: sibhelpUK@sibelius.com / +44 (0)20 7561 7997
Australia: helpAU@sibelius.com / 1300 652 172
Other countries: www.sibelius.com/support

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Messages in this thread

Brass and percussion notation - vln/vla/cello player, 21 Feb 08:27PM
     Re: Brass and percussion notation - Richard Vitale, 21 Feb 09:28PM
     Re: Brass and percussion notation - Laurence Payne, 21 Feb 10:30PM
         Re: Brass and percussion notation - vln/vla/cello player, 22 Feb 07:03PM
             Re: Brass and percussion notation - Daniel Spreadbury, 22 Feb 07:13PM
                 Re: Brass and percussion notation - vln/vla/cello player, 22 Feb 10:36PM
                     Re: Brass and percussion notation - Jason Dwyer, 23 Feb 03:26AM
                         Re: Brass and percussion notation - Daniel Spreadbury, 23 Feb 09:41AM